Trading Shots: On asking the tough questions and getting tough answers

In this week’s Trading Shots, MMAjunkie columnist Ben Fowlkes and retired UFC/WEC fighter Danny Downes look at a press conference tiff between the UFC President and a reporter who asked Jose Aldo about the UFC lawsuit.

Fowlkes: Danny, the UFC 189 “tour” stopped in Toronto late last week so Jose Aldo and Conor McGregor could trade the same verbal jabs and mean faces that they’ve carried with them to one media event after another, but this time something new happened.

Instead of just Aldo and McGregor getting into it, UFC President Dana White called a reporter a “d-ck” for asking Aldo about his pay, and whether it improved after the anti-trust lawsuit was filed against the UFC. When this reporter – Brian D’Souza, who said he was there for BloodyElbow.com, though there’s no story from him on Bloody Elbow about this – tried to take White to task for his response, White told him to “sit down” and “shut up.”

I have a lot of different thoughts on this, but first I want to know what you, as a former fighter and eager critic of the MMA media, make of this. Is it newsworthy? Is it just Dana being Dana? What say you, Danny?

Downes: “Dana White Calls Reporter a D-ck,” is as enticing a headline as the “Ronda Rousey Says She’s an Ovarian Goldmine,” ones I saw earlier this week. Are those newsworthy? Perhaps not, but they are attention-grabbing. There’s no real depth to either one of those statements. In a lot of ways they feel kind of lazy. It’s like how we get hundreds of articles about every small political gaffe. Look! Obama has a latte! Rick Perry forgot the words in his speech! Dana White doesn’t know how to respond to criticism!

The problem is that we spend too much time worrying about these small things instead of talking about the larger issues. Instead of discussing foreign policy or domestic issues, we say, “Look at this dumb thing he did!” We spend so much time mocking White for his incorrect use of the word “literally” that we aren’t breaking down and critiquing the content of those literally (OK, figuratively) explosive statements.

White calling a reporter a name is certainly a problem. At the very least it’s a lapse in judgment. If White lets this go, all we have is a non-answer from Aldo about how he’s happy with his situation. I wonder, though, maybe it wasn’t such a bad move.

Ben, I’d like to know if you think this interaction will affect any of your friends in the so-called media. We already know that you media types have more rules and protocols for dealing with UFC brass than the royal family. Can I ask this question in a press conference or wait until the scrum? Am I allowed to ask about Zuffa’s financials? Do you think this interaction between D’Souza and White will disenfranchise reporters from asking similar questions?

Dana White

Fowlkes: I don’t think media members are wondering if they “can” ask certain questions in press conferences so much as they wonder whether it would be useful in that setting. Like, if I want to know whether you’re mad at your boss, Danny, would I be more likely to get a forthright answer by asking you while your boss is standing next to you, or would it be smarter to wait until we’re talking one-on-one?

That calculation happens a lot, which is understandable, especially since press conferences generally suck for reporters. It’s a format that favors the people putting them on. That’s why UFC executives love them so much. They get their message out, but with some degree of control over how things unfold.

But before we get too bogged down in the response to the question, let’s talk about the question itself. I think there’s a place for this question in this setting. Here we have UFC executives claiming that this is the most money they’ve ever spent promoting an event. They’re bragging about huge live gate receipts and an enormously successful fiscal quarter, so clearly they’re not averse to conversations about money when those conversations are framed in a way they like.

It’s reasonable, then, to turn to the featherweight champion who has complained often about his pay and ask if he’s cool with how much of this coin is currently finding its way into his pocket. The UFC claims to be making a lot of money and throwing a lot of it around. Does the champ think he’s getting a fair share of it?

When White replies that the reporter is a “d-ck” for asking it, that’s a pretty typical overreaction from the hot-headed UFC President (just for fun, try picturing Lorenzo Fertitta responding that way), but White doesn’t stop Aldo from answering. It’s Aldo who decides to give a non-answer, to back off the criticism he’s lobbed in the past. The “shut up, sit down” comes from D’Souza  standing up and arguing with White about the name-calling. At that point, as the reporter, you’re not talking about Aldo and the UFC anymore. You’re talking about you and Dana White.

The question is valid. The response from White is, in fact, disrespectful, though without being surprising, since “respectful toward the media” isn’t anything that would make it into White’s obituary if he died tomorrow. So what did we learn here, other than the fact that Aldo isn’t willing to complain about his money while White is watching?

Downes: When you put it that way, we haven’t really learned anything. Someone got called a name. Not exactly the type of story that nabs you a Pulitzer. I suppose the one thing I’m left wondering, though, is what exactly is the “proper setting” for this discussion? If not a press conference, then where?

From Aldo’s point of view, you don’t want to embarrass your boss in a public setting. I learned that lesson when I called out Dann Stupp while he was having a family dinner at Applebee’s. It won’t make you a sympathetic figure, and it certainly doesn’t aid you at the negotiating table. At the same time, doesn’t there need to be a catalyst? Don’t we need someone to make a big gesture?

Even if we were to concede that we needed some great agitator to create much-needed serious conversation, who would do it? From fighters to media and everyone in between, people are looking out for their best interests.

Some no-name guys on the undercard might appreciate a UFC champion speaking out about pay issues, but how does that help the champ? Some random reporter might get some back slaps from colleagues for “asking the hard questions” or writing some scathing article, but where would that lead him or her? We all want someone to undertake these symbolic acts of rebellion, but we rarely volunteer to do them ourselves.

Maybe the fact that we haven’t learned anything new is the story. It’s just business as usual. The quality of fighter has improved, women’s MMA has gained in stature, and there’s a new Reebok deal, but is MMA any different today than it was five or 10 years ago?

Jose Aldo and Conor McGregor

Fowlkes: The thing about “asking the hard questions” is something I hear a lot. You look around on Twitter, or on various MMA blogs, and you see a lot of complaints about the lack of hard question-asking. You also see people – journalists, fans, Twitter heroes – asking those questions, but asking them into a void, seemingly on purpose. The asking is the point for them. Or rather, being seen asking is the point.

People act like reporters aren’t asking these questions, but that’s not true. Tons of questions have been put to tons of fighters about the UFC anti-trust lawsuit by this point. Those stories are out there. If they weren’t all that scintillating, it might be because, as with Aldo, the answers weren’t that interesting.

Again though, that’s not to say this question was out of line. It wasn’t. The UFC might be there to promote its show and sell some pay-per-views, but that doesn’t mean the media has to play that game.

There’s an exchange happening here. The UFC gives the media this time and opportunity with fighters and executives, hoping that this will drive the media to produce stories and those stories will drive fan interest in the event. By showing up, the media is participating in that.

But showing up does not obligate the media to do the UFC’s bidding. We still decide what questions to ask and what stories to write. UFC executives don’t have to like it when reporters use what the UFC thinks of as its promotional tool to ask questions that don’t sell tickets, but that’s part of the trade-off. And, in fairness, dude asked his question and got his answer. If White had left it at that, we wouldn’t even be discussing it.

What bothers me most is the fan reaction. White tells a reporter to sit down and shut up, and the reaction from the fans is almost gleeful. “Yeah, mega-rich fight promoter, take that haughty journalist down a peg or two! How dare he ask whether fighters feel they’re being fairly compensated!” I can’t think of another professional sport where fans so eagerly take up with the owners instead of the athletes.

It makes me wonder, is fighter pay one of those issues that we only wish people cared about? Do the rank-and-file fans not care whether their money is split fairly, as long as there are two dudes willing to hit each other on Saturday night? And fine, for the sake of a hypothetical, say that is the case. Say money is an issue that only fighters and media – not the readers those media serve – care about. Does that mean we should stop asking about it?

Downes: For such a non-story, there really is a lot to unpack here. As to your first point, there are a lot of paper tigers on the internet. It’s easy to have a “hot take” or be controversial when 1) nobody’s listening and 2) there’s nothing at stake. Making bold statements 140 characters at a time is not something you should be proud of. It’s like taking credit for asking “tons of” hard questions and then blaming fighters for not giving you “scintillating” responses. How convenient that there’s no documentable proof…

In fairness, I will say that fighters have done an extremely poor job in looking out for their best interests. That’s why we’re so surprised when someone like Conor McGregor or Ronda Rousey comes along. Not only do they have incredible talent, but they also have opinions on things! Every time I interview a fighter and they give some uninterested response or cliche answer, I want to yell. Not because it makes writing harder, but because this is their chance to actually make people care about them. Inside and outside the cage, playing it safe just doesn’t win you fans.

So why do they do it? There’s a variety of reasons. Some are apathetic and still cling to the belief that the fight itself is the only thing that matters. Some are simply boring people in general. A large segment, though, are scared. Now, there’s nothing explicitly that the UFC’s done to make fighters feel this way, but that’s still how they feel. In this sense, it’s no different from any other job. How many times have you complained about your supervisor at a job and never done anything about it?

As for fans, I’m not surprised at their indifference. Last week’s episode of “Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel” looked at NCAA athletes who have suffered long-term injuries during their collegiate career. Now that they’ve left school, they face mounting medical debt and lifelong disabilities.

At the end of the segment, they shared results of a Marist Poll. When asked if they support providing health insurance to college athletes after they graduate for long-term medical problems that are a result of injuries they received while playing college sports, only 56 percent of respondents said yes.

Imagine if you asked, “Should MMA fighters be paid more?” I would guess that the number would be even smaller. The majority of fans turn to sports for the same reason they turn to television — entertainment.

The fact of the matter is they don’t really care if some former Illinois State offensive lineman has had five separate back surgeries and struggles to cover medical costs. They definitely don’t care if Jose Aldo has more money in his bank account. They just want to watch him put on an exciting fight. And that’s why we have to keep asking about it. Even if it means being a d-ck.

Ben Fowlkes is MMAjunkie and USA TODAY’s MMA columnist. Danny Downes, a retired UFC and WEC fighter, is an MMAjunkie contributor who also writes for UFC.com and UFC 360. Follow them on twitter at @benfowlkesMMA and @dannyboydownes.