DEZNUTS (anonymous) 2 years ago
It TOOK YOU TWO SENTENCES TO PARAPHRase the words of Nick Diaz which took him about six minutes to deliver thru a microphone. if your taken down and cant get up you deserve to lose by descision. sweeps, backdoor escapes, pulling guard. haha fightings harder than the fighers. respect
MtlBen (anonymous) 2 years ago
I agree with this stuff, you can stay on the guy to control the position but hey don't just let your shoulders and head close to the guy all the remaining time of the round cause you're avoiding the fight! Controling the position is part of a setup and it has to end with something offensive, you need to finish, all this is a climax. Just like a takedown gives you point but you have to do something with it but hey, the sport is still evolving and those things will be fix in the futur.
We don't see these problems in asian organisations cause wresting is more popular in the USA and the UFC is based there but in the end, we have a fu***** nice sport right there and it's even more promising to see that there's room for improvments and that it will be taken in consideration because of the youth of the sport, in opposition of boxing for example.
Wrestlethis (anonymous) 2 years ago
I personally dont consider 3 rounds of one fighter lying on top of another as controlling the fight, I see it as avoiding the fight as Nick Diaz mentions.
Its easy to hold someone down and avoid strikes from the top. Its easy to push someone against the cage and clinch and avoid strikes. Its easy to hold someone from the bottom and avoid strikes.
I agree with Diaz, if a fighter is holding and bumping with little hammer fists and little elbows, and avoiding throwing proper strikes to prevent from reversals or submission attemps then you are not really fighting.
The rules currently are the cause of many of the boring fights that take place in the UFC, wrestlers have a huge advantage with the scoring system.
Its easy to say 'why dont you get up' but when a fighter is concentratring every second of his energy into holding you down, and no energy into effective striking or submission attemps its a lot easier said then done.
Personally I want to see entertaining fights. However with this easy way of winning fights without having to actually do any damage or show any real submission skills, its a safe bet to say many fighters will opt for the 'safe' way of grinding out a boring points win when they are faced with an oponent that will more than likely knock them out on the feet, or submit them on the floor.
Everyone has their own take on the fight game at the moment, If youre happy with the way things are currently then Im happy for you. Im just saying, Id rather see entertaining fights than boring hold down points wins.
"Its easy to hold someone down and avoid strikes from the top. Its easy to push someone against the cage and clinch and avoid strikes. Its easy to hold someone from the bottom and avoid strikes."
> If this is SO easy, why don't everybody do that ? Ohhh, maybe because in fact this is *not* that easy ?
"Personally I want to see entertaining fights".
>I think that is the point. You want a show, but fighting isn't about "making the show" in *my* opinion. Fighting is to face someone and manage to find a way to win. Now, you can do it by submission or (T)KO. I like it too because it's spectacular. But now, in a fight, there's also a strategy. Finding a way to gas out your opponent is, indeed, a *very* good strategy to win (thought it's boring to see, I agree).
So now the question is : What would be the most important thing to you as a fighter ? Win or impress the crowd, if you had to chose ? Personaly, i think fighting is first of all about finding the way to impose your will on your opponent, whenever it looks boring. Do you remember the first UFC ? Everybody was wondering what Gracie was doing, it wasn't brutal, it was boring, slow, unespected. What do you recall today from Royce ? That he was a performer, a showman able to embrace the crowd, or that he was just unbeatable ? Just a question of point of view.
"Id rather see entertaining fights than boring hold down points wins"
> Well, me too but ultimately I understand that it can go to the end of the judges. And if it does, it either means that one was strong enough to manage his opponent (or that this opponent wasn't good enough to take advantage of the other). That's the game.
> Same to you, bro ! (By the way, it's so niiiiiiiiiice to read from someone able to discuss his point of view without insults or disrespect every two words, that's for that).
''If this is SO easy, why don't everybody do that?''
I like to think that not everyone is doing it because most proffessional fighters would rather fight to win the fight, rather than fight to win an opinion of a fight. What happens when a fighter gets rocked but not knocked out? They go for a clinch more often than not, to avoid strikes, thats because its far safer than staying on the outside. What happens when a fighter nearly gets submitted, they go for a hold down to avoid further submission attemps more often than not. It is definately easier for a highly trained proffesional fighter to hold someone down than it is to knock them out or submit them. And its even worse with these wrestlers, they train to hold people down all their lives. Holding is not fighting in my opinion.
''Fighting is to face someone and manage to find a way to win.''
Avoiding a fight by holding someone down is not finding a way to win. I dont disagree with you, the way the rules are at the moment its a very easy way to win, very safe, and also sadly very dull. My point is the same as Nick Diaz, I think the rules should be changed to combat this style of non-fighting.
''What do you recall today from Royce?''
Ah memories, old school UFC was great. From the question you asked, only 1 answer comes to my mind. He FINISHED most of his fights with submissions. 14 wins 12 submissions.
The problem I have with the way the scoring is done, it makes fighters take a points descision as an option to win. I dont think a fighter should be AIMING to win on points. A lot of the fighters dont go for finishes, they dont go for submissions, they just hold and bump for 3 rounds.
I know Dana White isnt happy with this new style of fighting as Ive heard him talk about it in many interviews.
Hopefully something will be done soon to prevent wrestlers from stalling out wins and avoiding fighting.
I agree with everything you said Kaine, if winning by points is an option it sould be taken advantage of. However a lot of people including myself and evidently Nick Diaz dont think its a proper fight if you aim to win by points.
The ultimate question is, what changes could be done to make the fights more entertaining without limiting the ability of wrestlers and jujutsu fighters on the floor?
Quicker stand ups if there is no progress or damage being dealt from the grounded fighters?
Penalties for ''excessive holding'' or ''stalling''?
I personally think Dana White shoud introduce BIG bonuses for finished fights. 10% or 20% purse increases for a finish would get the fighters knocking each other out and submitting people every time!
Thanks for reading.